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I will not be heading any petition drive. Cat makes a good point about the name calling, even though I think thin skinned petty little tyrant is an accurate description of Rob White.
I do not do causes. I got in trouble because Etsy screwed up and may have lost many of us sales. There is no way to know how many. I spoke out strongly about how they conducted the experiment. I asked questions, got nothing but canned responses and re-asked the same questions. There is just so much "We value you and we promise to get back to you sometime." you can take. Even the private convos with admins assigned to "handle" me just kept shoveling the same old BS.
It came to a head that Friday night when Rob took down an innocuous little thread, "It's Friday night, do you know where your experiment is". The only way I could interpret that was he was sending me a message. "I am unaccountable to you. I can take you down anytime for any reason." He could not give a reason for removing that post and closing the thread. Since I thought they might use that as the infamous 3rd strike, I made my mind up to go out with a bang. Even if I had left his description out, I would have been punished for questioning an admin decision in public.
Several times since, many people have asked similar questions about mutings, intimidation, and Etsy's total disregard for the sellers. And ya'll have received the same BS answers I did.
Voice your opinions up there all you want. They will only respond to what they want to. Hard and uncomfortable questions will be ignored. Yes, they say they listen and and make changes based on our input.
How's the new feedback situation working out for you?
I do not do causes. I got in trouble because Etsy screwed up and may have lost many of us sales. There is no way to know how many. I spoke out strongly about how they conducted the experiment. I asked questions, got nothing but canned responses and re-asked the same questions. There is just so much "We value you and we promise to get back to you sometime." you can take. Even the private convos with admins assigned to "handle" me just kept shoveling the same old BS.
It came to a head that Friday night when Rob took down an innocuous little thread, "It's Friday night, do you know where your experiment is". The only way I could interpret that was he was sending me a message. "I am unaccountable to you. I can take you down anytime for any reason." He could not give a reason for removing that post and closing the thread. Since I thought they might use that as the infamous 3rd strike, I made my mind up to go out with a bang. Even if I had left his description out, I would have been punished for questioning an admin decision in public.
Several times since, many people have asked similar questions about mutings, intimidation, and Etsy's total disregard for the sellers. And ya'll have received the same BS answers I did.
Voice your opinions up there all you want. They will only respond to what they want to. Hard and uncomfortable questions will be ignored. Yes, they say they listen and and make changes based on our input.
How's the new feedback situation working out for you?
I found your blog through a link on Zibbet. I was a buyer only on Etsy. For over 3 years, I made 300 plus purchasers and spent $100's there.
ReplyDeleteI was livid when they removed buyer feedback and all the appreciation photo's I had left. We had no warning this was coming! I was very proud of my 100% perfect rating as a buyer there, it made me feel valued and trustworthy.
I shut down my account and have stuck to my word, not one purchase there since. I signed up as a buyer with Zibbet and, although there selection is much smaller, I'm hoping more buyers move over there too.
I strongly believe in supporting TRUE small business. If I want cheap, mass produced crap from China, I can go to my local dollar store. Etsy's become overcome by pure greed IMO!
Found your blog in the same Zibbet thread I am sure!
ReplyDeleteThere is a long line of mutees, who for whatever reason took a stand against an Etsy policy, in hopes of bettering the community. Some rightly , some wrongly. Etsy by it's very nature is populated with fiercely independent thinkers & doer's. If most people knew how easy it was to be muted & how badly it impacts your shop they would never post with regularity in the forums. Even the sweetest cupcake frosting can turn bad.
The secret Paypal test to me was the last straw. I wonder sometimes how they keep themselves out of court.That luck will not continue neither will their dreamy reputation. People are talking.
Oh...and your description of Rob White, spot on.
You know, I'm trying to be objective here, but this is all just overkill and has gotten to be a little ridiculous. I understand about the mistakes made, and the lack of decent customer service, and even the "experiments" to try and change things up a little on the website. But come on! Mr. Dougy seems to be exactly what he describes himself as. A cranky old (I could think of a better word for him) fart. And it seems as though he's brought out the minions of like minded complainers and never satisfied Debbie Downers that we find in every facet of our society. Is Etsy really any different than any other large company? Sprint, AT&T, etc. etc. all have terrible customer service, do they not? Sure, speak out. Speak your mind! Nothing wrong with that. But good GOD, when you get to the point where you feel you have to be just downright degrading, then pick up your ball, and go to another playground!!!!
ReplyDeleteYou know, I've looked at Mr. Erwin's little rants, and seen the little crab-apples that following along. It's kind of reminiscent of the whole Jim Jones thing. The majority of Dougy's "followers" consider themselves "cranky old farts" too. Go figure! You think? They just love the bitching. The way I see it, Mr. Erwin contributes NOTHING to this so-called Etsy community except a few fees that he pays to sell his pipes and whatever else he "crafts". I see a bunch of followers for HIM, but see that he has not followed anyone himself. I see people that have "favorited" his shop and his items, but see NO shops that he has returned the favor for, other than the shit smoking ones that he cares for. Other than that, all I see from him is complaints.
Everyone even got to the point of "free speech" on one of those silly complaint boards. I mean, really? REALLY?? You people ARE aware that if you don't like the sevice provided to sell your stuff on, that you are free to move on elsewhere, and do something else. You know, kinda like when we see people bitching about how bad this country sucks, and we think..."well, if you don't like it, move to another country that's better"? But no...you'd rather waste more time ranting and raving and beating this dead horse to hell, than to do something for yourselves if you are not happy with it. Man, I tell you...it's just mind boggling.
Anyway, I've got to hand it to you, Mr. Erwin. You certainly know how to stir up the bee hive of the perpetually angry bees. You know, the ones that only find the bad in things, and never the good? Hell, from your posts, you'd think your livelihood was being stripped away by this little website, and that you'll be needing to re-mortgage your home and go on welfare as a result. This is a hobby for you, is it not? Don't make it sound like it's do or die. On your profile, you say you're a "tinkerer". Hasn't Etsy done ANYTHING good for you? Don't you have ANYTHING positive to say? Have you EVER??
I'm sorry to say, but you sound more of one of the Jim Jones persons who has drunk the Etsy Kool Aid.
Delete"Is Etsy really any different than any other large company? Sprint, AT&T, etc. etc. all have terrible customer service, do they not?" It sure is. At least those companies have a phone number who you, as their customer, can call if there is a problem. Does Etsy?
"Sure, speak out. Speak your mind! Nothing wrong with that." Well, obviously, Etsy seems to think so. They permamute anyone that isn't a cupcake or cheerleader.
"But good GOD, when you get to the point where you feel you have to be just downright degrading, then pick up your ball, and go to another playground!!!!" There is one cupcake in the Etsy forums that is always degrading OPs and other responders with her superior, I know everything attitude. I don't see anyone in the forums telling her to stuff a sock in it.
You obviously don't know Doug. He's one of the most honest, supporting people I've known in a long time. And he DOES have lost of positive things to say.
In the future, confine your rants to people or places you actually know about.
Speaking of rant, is that you Brandi?
DeleteI think people stay because they love what they have built and they love what they have created with others in the community. People also have the tendency to bitch and complain because they feel as though they haven't been heard and taken seriously. Some of the "old farts" are that way because they remember what used to be. People are literally being crushed by these re sellers. It is hurting them.
DeleteAlso, it's not easy to up and leave what you have invested so much time and money in. It's hard to change horse mid-stream because for the smaller shop owners it's starting over.
I stay on Etsy for the traffic. The ease of the system - except for this new feedback system. And that's why Etsy can do what they do. They know they have a monopoly on traffic and renown in the arena of handmade, vintage and artisan products. So yes we complain, yes sometimes it doesn't appear to be all that constructive. When people stop complaining and just move on is when I'd worry. It shows a lack of passion when you just roll over and don't speak your mind. Just my opinion of course!
DeleteP.S. I'd like to add that if Etsy did a bit better job of maintaining communication with its customers, then there would be a lot less of all of this.
DeleteChad Dickerson, is that you? Has to be an Etsy admin if not Chad. Maybe Rob. His ego has been scorched. He might be having a hard time getting over it. He surely has been shutting down those threads lately.
DeleteGuess you have not read as many of my posts as you make out you have. I also discount the opinions of those who do not have the courage to name themselves publicly.
ReplyDeleteI guess that's true, Doug. I did not read ALL of your posts. Maybe there is some good in there somewhere. And I have no doubt that you discount my opinion, anonymous or not. Seems to me that the majority of these comments from your "followers" are anonymous as well. Do you discount those too, or only the ones that oppose your opinion? Oh, and by the way, my name is Arin Metheny. It's got nothing to do with courage. What's there to be afraid of? We're ALL "anonymous" sitting back here typing on our computers. Like the accolades you were recieving for being so "brave" and "outspoken" for typing on your computer. Nice work. You're their hero!
ReplyDeleteFunny.....you seem to have remembered exactly who he is, what he posted about, and that many, many people listened. For someone who doesn't want to waste time, you certainly seem to be doing just that here. Why exactly are you commenting and arguing on a blog that you don't have an invested interest in? Is there a benefit to you in belittling other people? Maybe you need to take some of your own advice given above...ie. if you don't like the blog, don't read it.
DeleteThe "followers", as you describe them, who remain anonymous out of concern that Etsy will retaliate against them. That speaks volumes when Etsy sellers feel that way about a company they support. I assume you are a satisfied Etsy seller by your reaction. If Etsy is doing it for you, I am happy for you.
ReplyDeleteHow much my financial well being is dependent upon Etsy is irrelevant. What is relevant is that Etsy would rather let the techs run free without having safeguards in place to minimize disruptions to the sales. It is relevant that Etsy feels it is OK to ignore their customers, we sellers.
Since Etsy will not let me speak these concerns in their forums, I have chosen a more public forum.
The only posts here that will get deleted are ones that are actually defamatory, including unproven accusations about Etsy
I agree with you Doug; most anonymous people are ones that have not packed up there store yet and still have some items up on Etsy. Or like myself someone that isn't ready for Etsy to pull the plug on there store prematurely.
ReplyDeleteIt is a said state of affairs when you have to worry about what you say and who you say it to. All this because you disagree with someone on Etsy.
Doug, I respect your opinions and thoughts on the many ridiculous things Etsy has done to its customers (the sellers) in the past year. We are continually bombarded with changes, test, experiments and 'improvements' which make it difficult to be effective as a seller and frustrating for buyers.
ReplyDeleteDon't ever stop speaking out! I know you won't.
hmm....I find it strange that "Arin" doesn't exist in google-really making up names?...how cute.
ReplyDeleteInteresting that you say your name is Arin Metheny, yet you don't show up in any search, including an anywho search. Seems you don't exist. lol
ReplyDeleteI'm always late to these things.
ReplyDeleteArin, let this man have his blog. Don't like it, don't fucking read it. Follow your own advice. Complaining about complainers is hypocritical and makes you look so ridiculously stupid.
"Everyone even got to the point of 'free speech' on one of those silly complaint boards. I mean, really? REALLY?? You people ARE aware that if you don't like the sevice provided to sell your stuff on, that you are free to move on elsewhere, and do something else."